Wednesday, June 07, 2006

Mephistopheles



No kingdom made of human hands can stand
Too bad about MacBeth
In order to possess that corruptible crown
Gotta make a deal with Mr Death - Bob Dylan


Faust was a doctor, and it was for knowledge that he signed his contract with the Devil. According to Goethe, modern science - Carl Sagan's "candle in the dark" of a demon-haunted world - is ignorantly under the patronage of the demon Mephistopheles.

Rupert Sheldrake brushes against Faust and our own lousy bargains in his trialogue with Terence McKenna and Ralph Abraham entitled Chaos, Creativity and Cosmic Consciousness:

How seriously do we need to take the idea that our whole society and civilization is under the possession of such a spirit.... How much are fallen angels actually guiding and perverting the progress of science and technology? Is a great war between the good and evil angels being acted out on Earth? We hardly know how to think or talk about such possibilities since they are so alien to the official, standard models of Western history.

Like Faust, the original sin of intelligence agencies is the appetite for unbound knowledge. The death-dealing, the drugs and guns, the fellowship of gangsters and terrorists all follow upon this seemingly benign desire.

The CIA damned itself at its birth by sheltering and shepherding the devils of Nazi Germany into the United States, and casting them as seeds across the western world. And it was all for knowledge. For knowledge of camp experiments, of anti-Soviet espionage, of rocket science. Like a medieval magician invoking demons to do his bidding while binding them in the name of God, Allen Dulles recruited Nazis into the service of America. But America is a changeable god, and Dulles and his Nazis helped change it.

Yesterday it was revealed the CIA knew the whereabouts of Adolf Eichmann, but withheld the information because it might have led to exposing the Nazi pedigree of the anti-communist intelligence efforts in West Germany. It would seem that Intelligence, and the protection of even relatively trivial knowledge, can be reason enough to overlook holocausts.

We too, rightly, want to know. But if that's all we want we'll slip into error ourselves, amassing data which won't change a thing but will leave us alternately thrilled and depressed. Knowledge must be the servant of justice, or we're just more clients for the devil.

51 Comments:

Anonymous Shrubageddon said...

I have several things to add.

1.) Information and knowledge are not the same thing.

2.) Knowledge is relative.

3.) What is often held up to be knowledge, is anything but.

Knowledge is very much a Pandora's Box.

9:00 PM  
Anonymous penitent said...

Knowledge without faith, is like sex without love.

"...and whatsoever is not of faith is sin." Paul

10:02 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Gnosis--the idea that knowledge can bring salvation--is at the very heart of the crisis that confronts us. The Church was wise in understanding the dangers of gnosis, knowing that ultimately it brought not salvation but delusion. Man in exercising his will does not discover the "mind of God," but rather finds, again and again, that he has been deceived.

Gnosticism is always with us, from silly movies like "DaVinci Code" to malevolent ideologies run rampant, such as Capitalism and Communism. The enshrining of the Corporation, with its soulless operating principle of "profit no matter what harm is done," is as wrong, as deceitful, as Communism, which in practice only was another manifestation of the Will to Power. Today we have Straussian "neoconservatism," which seeks to conserve nothing whatsoever, but harnesses the forces of destruction to serve the aims of rapacious elites.

Mankind, left to his own devices, becomes an insatiable beast, without restraint, and, unwittingly or not, adheres to a model of evil quite congruent with conventional "religious" notions of demoniac influence. What is non-diabolical about the Holocaust, or Abu Ghraib? What is non-diabolical about Hiroshima or Haditha? Because we fight under the banner of Democracy? Of Liberty? Empty words, employed by elites to dominate the masses, mere manifestations of gnostic propaganda, wrapped up not in monk's robes but in plasticene flight suits and gumboots. The sword that struck the head from a Bourbon king's shoulders is the same sword employed today to exploit oil-rich lands and market heroin for profit. Only the names have changed. The poison is the same, ageless, and the only antidote is love.

10:11 PM  
Blogger Jeff said...

tal on Progressive Independent contributed this interesting quote from Rudolf Steiner 1909 on the origin of Mephiz-Topel:

"...The old clairvoyant consciousness would have been replaced by an object-consciousness, such, however, as would have also been alive to the spirit. As it was, the Luciferic spirits led man earlier to a hardened body; man beheld the physical world earlier than would otherwise have been possible for him. As a result he entered upon the third and last phase of the Atlantean period in a totally different condition than would have been the case had the divine spiritual powers help undisputed sway. Instead of a world aglow with the spirit of higher beings, he now saw only a physical world. The divine world had withdrawn from him. The Luciferic beings had interfered with his astral body. Man having now united himself with the sensible world, other beings — the Ahrimanic spirits of Zarathustra (also called Mephistophelian) now interfered with his external perception and with the relation of his Ego to the outer world. Man's physical, etheric, and astral bodies are not so constituted as they would have been had the higher Gods alone worked upon them. The beings known as Luciferic gained admittance into man's astral body and caused his premature fall from Paradise. The consequence of this Luciferic influence was the perversion of man's perception of the outer world by the Ahrimanic or Mephistophelian (Satanic) spirits. The latter now showed the outer world merely in its physical form, and not as it truly is. Hence the Hebrew name for these spirits who deluded man with a vain show: `Mephiz-Topel'; `Mephiz' the vitiator and `Topel' the liar. That is the derivation of the name Mephistopheles. He is the same spirit as Ahriman. Now what was the effect of Ahriman's influence as distinguished from Lucifer's?

"Lucifer caused the undue deterioration of the forces of the astral body, and the premature densification of man's physical substance. To be sure, man attained thereby the freedom which would otherwise have been denied him. The Mephistophelian spirits case a veil over the spiritual foundation of the world and mocked man with a world that is an illusion. Mephistopheles infused into man the belief that the world is merely a material existence, and that there is nothing spiritual in and behind all matter. The scene which Goethe depicts so wonderfully in his Faust is continually being enacted in humanity as a whole. We see Faust, on the one hand, seeking the way to the spiritual world; on the other hand, Mephistopheles who describes the spiritual world as `nothing', because it is in his interest to represent the world of sense as everything. Faust retorts in words which every spiritual investigator would have used in a similar case: `In thy Nothing I hope to find my All!'

"Only when we are aware that in every particle of matter there is spirit, and that the idea of matter is a lie; only when we recognize in Mephistopheles the spirit who vitiates thought in the world, then only can we conceive the outer world in its true form. Now what was necessary for humanity, to help it onward and prevent it being overwhelmed by the fate prepared for it by Lucifer and Ahriman? ...

"...Nowadays, a person who knows nothing of spiritual science would laugh if he were told that the influences of the Luciferic spirits are embedded in his astral body. He does not, of course, know that these beings exert a far stronger influence upon him when he pays no heed to them...."

12:25 AM  
Anonymous Richard said...

So then L. Ron's Xenu would be his ham-handed Mephistopholean rip-of

Combining Mephiz (corruptor), when Xenu physically corrupts both the landscape & the physical bodies of the thetans.

From Wikipedia:
"Simultaneously, the planted charges erupted. Atomic blasts ballooned from the craters of Loa, Vesuvius, Shasta, Washington, Fujiyama, Etna, and many, many others. Arching higher and higher, up and outwards, towering clouds mushroomed, shot through with flashes of flame, waste and fission. Great winds raced tumultuously across the face of Earth, spreading tales of destruction. Debris-studded, and sickly yellow, the atomic clouds followed close on the heels of the winds. Their bow-shaped fronts encroached inexorably upon forest, city and mankind, they delivered their gifts of death and radiation. A skyscraper, tall and arrow-straight, bent over to form a question mark to the very idea of humanity before crumbling into the screaming city below...
The now-disembodied victims' souls, which Hubbard called thetans, were blown into the air by the blast."

& Topel (Liar):

also from Wikipedia:

" The hundreds of billions of captured thetans were taken to a type of cinema, where they were forced to watch a "three-D, super colossal motion picture" for 36 days. This implanted what Hubbard termed "various misleading data" (collectively termed the R6 implant) into the memories of the hapless thetans, "which has to do with God, the Devil, space opera, etcetera"."

Ah me! Archetype, O Archetype! Wherefore art thou Archetype?

1:08 AM  
Anonymous Richard said...

By the way, these "entities" that you mention on this blog in various guises have most likely been used by Native American shamans for tens of thousands of years, following carefully proscribed rituals ,for the benefit of their tribal circles.

Doesn't it strike you as a bit funny, in a....ummmm.....darkly ironic way, that white folks come along like the proverbial bull in a china shop & completely fuck up the mojo?

Not that I'm implying Native Americans weren't warlike, it's just that I don't recall any historical instances where they were conducting huge canoe raids on Europe.

But white folks come along & mutate it into this testostorone fueled self-destructive cornholing of the common good.

This only comes to mind because I've been perusing a bit of the White Power Movements contributions to world literature.
Also recently rewatched 'Blood in the Face' with its pudgy sweaty white guys rambling on about 80,000 Mongolians wearing backpack nuclear weapons in Baja California, poised to lead the UN invasion of America.
Interestingly enough, on the 2nd day of the Iraq eviseration I heard Rush Limbaugh ponderously announce that he had just received word that Saddam Hussein had backpack nuclear weapons.

I guess that goes to show that Mephis-Topel may be a liar & corruptor but he's not a particularly inventive liar & corruptor.

1:39 AM  
Blogger Uncle $cam said...

We must ultimately assume at the highest theoretical levels of enlightened management theory, a preference or a tendency to identify with more and more of the world, moving toward the ultimate of mysticism, a fusion with the world, or peak experience, cosmic consciousness, etc.

~ Abraham H. Maslow
Maslow on Management
(Wiley, 1998) Page 42

2:56 AM  
Blogger Sounder said...

Conservatives fall for the lies of Ahriman, while liberals fall for the lies of Lucifer.

An incorrectly chosen imperative ensures that concepts of Justice are likewise perverted.

i.e. To bad all those people have to die, but a 'greater' good must be served. So we remain stoic in our righteous ignorance.

Poor post, sorry but I gotta to go to work.

8:14 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Richard @ 1:08 AM:

Good observation! Recognizing the Native American shamanistic perspective seems to bring clarity on these matters.

I happened upon an article by Michael Sharp in red-ice.net after reading Jeff's post, entitled "The Time Is Now - Duality Must Go" and thought there were some similarities in thought...

"As above in consciousness, So below in matter.

Remember our super charged energetic environment.

The closer we get to 2012, the easier it will be to manifest what is in our consciousness. As the energy increases, manifestation will take on increasingly magical qualities. As the energy levels ascend, what use to take centuries or decades will take months and days and, eventually, hours and minutes. Manifestation will continue to accelerate and, sometime after the 2012 * pop * date, it will become pretty much instant.

This will be Shambhala “if” you’re in a good headspace. It will be something else if you’re hanging onto duality.

Now if you take a look around you can see the truth of what I am saying.

The new energy environment is already having a major impact on the realities of this world and we’re still a significant distance away from the energy peak we are aiming for.

Things are changing fast now.

We have wonderful new technologies popping up on what seems like a weekly basis. We have some countries making massive social and political progress but, on the other hand, some of us seem to be in danger of falling off the razor’s balancing edge into the fiery pit of duality. What’s disconcerting to me (and I suspect to many of you) is the way the ugly extremes of duality are beginning to manifest in this fine world.

It all seems to be spinning just a little too close to the precipice. We have wonderful technological and spiritual advances but we also have this ugly world of duality which seems to be rising up at us like some super-charged third reich. Soldiers are shooting children for revenge, governments are building internment camps, and our world leaders seem bent on global destruction.

We seem to be spiraling down a mucky tunnel into oblivion.

The whole world seems to be in jeopardy."

9:43 AM  
Anonymous Luposapien said...

A few hunches of mine:

Justice is not now, nor ever has been, metted out by government. To say that our laws provide for justice is like saying that the science of physics provides for gravity. Justice, if anything, is a function of nature (God, if you must). The balance is self-enforcing.

The ends don't justify the means. So far as I can tell, at least a few questionalbe assumptions go into this. One, that we can accurately predict all of the results of our actions. But, more importantly, that there is such a thing as an 'End' in the first place. Beyond that, even if we decided to take some arbitrary point in space/time as our chosen 'end', what is it if not the expression of the combined influences of the means which led up to it. It seems more accurate to say 'The end is determined by the means.'

KNOWledge is a slippery CONcept, and those who lay claim to the Truth are dangerous, deluded animals.

I suspect...

10:00 AM  
Blogger Jeff said...

Daniel Pinchbeck in 2012, The Return of Quetzacoatl, on Steiner's view of Lucifer and Ahriman:

I would not have been receptive to Steiner's cosmological frame if it weren't for my own shamanic journeys, which seemed to open doorways into my psyche that never completely closed. In the vast ecology of mind he describes, our consciousness is inseparable from other forms of sentience - such as the goblins, or postmodern Grays, who swarm us as we pass between sleep and dream. Steiner split up the unitary Christian devil into different forms that constantly work upon the human psyche, seeking to divert us into deviant paths, Lucifer, the "light-bringer," draws us upward into realms of imagination, beauty, fantasy, and egoistic pride, pulling us away from the Earth. The other power is Ahriman, dark and malevolent Earth spirit of the Zoroastrian faith, also known as Satan, Mephistopheles, and Moloch. Ahriman drags us downward - into the mineral world, materiality, mechanization, and death. Our age of materialism represents the temporary ascendance of Ahriman, who strives to make the world into a machine. Studying Steiner, I recognized Lucifer and Ahriman as "psychic facts," part of the wallpaper of my new "psychic worldspace."

10:31 AM  
Anonymous Richard said...

Y'know, I don't always agree with everything Mr. Wells posts or the comments posted here......

.....hell, there are times when I don't even agree with what I spout out 2 days after the spouting...my 'forgive the Haditha murderers' post comes to mind....

...but everyone here, for the most part, appears to be approaching this from some form of moral standpoint.

I bring this up because today was my 8 & 7 year old's last school day, so I took my 4 kids out to lunch at a nearby family restaurant.

Sitting behind us were 3 people, & I use the term loosely, discussing Iraq. Of course, they mentioned the 'ding dong, the witch is dead' bagging of Al-Zarqawi.

I then heard one of the gentlemen(?) bring up the Haditha slaughter. He said, "Yeah, they killed women & children. It was great. I loved it. They shouldn't do anything to those guys."

The older gentlemen then mentioned the son of a neighbor of his who was a Marine. recently returned from Iraq. He said, "I asked him what he did over there...drive a tank...reconstruction...what?
He told me I kill people all the fucking time. But he wouldn't give me any details."
The 1st guy said, "Aw man, that's great. I love it."

So, since I'd rather be dead & buried & rotting in the summer ground than affiliate myself in any way shape or form with gutless psycho-wannabes whose deepest fantasies obviously involve shooting children in the back of the head, I retract my earlier post. I apparently had my head lodged deep in my own rectum on that day. My typing fingers, on the other hand, were quite free to grab my foot & shove it into my mouth.

Sorry.

Mr. Wells quoted Rudolph Steiner who said, "The beings known as Luciferic gained admittance into man's astral body and caused his premature fall from Paradise. The consequence of this Luciferic influence was the perversion of man's perception of the outer world by the Ahrimanic or Mephistophelian (Satanic) spirits. The latter now showed the outer world merely in its physical form, and not as it truly is. Hence the Hebrew name for these spirits who deluded man with a vain show: `Mephiz-Topel'; `Mephiz' the vitiator and `Topel' the liar."

It appears to me that some of us needed far less Mephistophelian deluding than others. In fact, it appears the rich & well-heeled aren't the only ones who whole-heartedly embrace the "perversion of man's perception of the outer world."

Y'all will have to excuse me now because my head hurts.

4:16 PM  
Anonymous Uncle $cam said...

The God of a Thousand & 1 Names

NAME: The Trickster or A-Chey (Cambodia), Amaguq 'wolf' (Inuit), Bamapana (Northern Australia), Birbal (North India), Coyote Old Man (Number of Native American Tribes), Discordia (Roman), Saint Frances (Christian), Hermes (Greek), Hanuman (India and other areas), Kaulu (Polynesian), Khwaja Nasruddin (Muslim), Loki (Norse), Eris (Greek), Queen Mab (16th century English Lit), Manabozho 'Great Hare' (Algonquin), Merlin (Arthurian), Oli (Yap Islands), Qat (Banks Islands), Ti Malice (Haiti), Wemicus (Ojibwa), Wisagatcak 'Whiskey Jack' (Cree of Canada) as well as Spider, Bluejay, Crow, Mouse (different native American tribes) and many MANY others.

Yes, Trickster is June's God of the Month.

9:28 PM  
Anonymous slomo said...

Richard @ 1:08 AM:

I'm coming to believe that war, per se, is not the problem. Violence is woven into the physical realm: every act of eating is an act of violence perpetrated by one biological organism upon another. If you truly see the spirit inherent in every single subatomic particle, then you know that every thing feels pain and suffers when it is destroyed/transformed. It's just the way it is in this realm of samsara.

What makes the "white folk" different is our rapaciousness. Violence is done without giving back. The way of the machine is to seek efficiency, and therefore concentrate power, which is done only by taking and never giving back. This is life out of balance, violence that always destroys and never leads to regeneration.

I'm reading Welcome to the Machine by Derrick Jensen. It brings this idea into sharp focus. In particular, Jensen focuses on the way our science obtains information (and knowledge) only by tearing apart the objects of its study. Want to know how a body works? Vivisect it. Want to know how an atom works? Split it. The goal of science is control, through technology, which is never value-neutral.

9:54 PM  
Anonymous slomo said...

To follow up my last post... Here's a more concrete way to distinguish between types of war: if you are going to war with your neighboring tribe to settle a dispute over hunting territory (either because you believe your tribe deserves more or theirs deserves less), then you'll probably fight and kill only as much as you need to establish your position. This is a "war" that is consistent with life, and is happening at all levels from the subatomic to the human to the galactic.

On the other hand, if you are going to war with your neighboring tribe to take all of their food, belongings, "resources", and enslave them to work only for your benefit, then this is a war that concentrates power and leads to a life out of balance, a way of death.

I'm not saying that all Native American wars were of the former type and none were of the latter type. But I believe that Native Americans tended to fight more frequently in the former manner. And I also realize I'm making some somewhat arbitrary distinctions here. I'm not trying to create legalistic definitions, but rather suggest qualitative differences in violence based on whether power is concentrated.

10:02 PM  
Anonymous silly rabbit said...

Soldiers are shooting children for revenge, governments are building internment camps, and our world leaders seem bent on global destruction.

I'd go even farther and say that children are shooting soldiers for revenge, and goverments are turning entire countries into internment camps.

Also, you didn't mention what I think is the most dramatic and important development in these weird times-- the vast numbers of women rising up around the world. Did anyone notice that the countries that banned the Da Vinci Code were not the heavily Christian countries, but rather the most patriarchal and misogynist, like China and Pakistan? The fear of offending Christians seems to me to be a red herring. The book is poorly written and cursorily researched, and I hear the movie is rather dull, easily ignored. But as a pop culture vehicle for promoting the emergence of the divine feminine, this pulp fiction apparently poses a threat.

11:23 PM  
Anonymous Kris Millegan said...

How much are fallen angels actually guiding and perverting the progress of science and technology?

One of Boners main songs is the Whiffenpoof song,the song became the unofficialsong of the OSS and according to reports from Daniel Hopsicker, Baryy Seal said that is was a song that would be song around the CIA-Drugs/Guns campfire at various spookfests. So is it just the melody?

Look and read the words:

To the tables down at Mory's
To the place where Louie dwells
To the dear old Temple bar we love so well
Sing the Whiffenpoofs assembled with their glasses raised on high
And the magic of their singing casts its spell

Yes, the magic of their singing of the songs we love so well
"Shall I Wasting" and "Mavourneen" and the rest
We will serenade our Louie while life and voice shall last
Then we'll pass and be forgotten with the rest

We're poor little lambs who have lost our way
Baa, baa, baa
We're little black sheep who have gone astray
Baa, baa, baa

Gentleman songsters off on a spree
Doomed from here to eternity
Lord have mercy on such as we
Baa, baa, baa

====
A "whiffenpoofis generlay depicted asa flying dragon-type reptile.

Part of the song is based on a Kipling poem/song with these words -- "To the legion of the lost ones,
To the cohorts of the damned,

http://www.yale.edu/whiffenpoofs/history/

)n another note,Mary Pinchot Meyer,friend of Allen Dulles and Tim Leary,and mistress of JFK(supposedly gave JFK pot and LSD). And married CIA Agent/World Federalist Cord Meyer.

Mary's father is Bones.

http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/JFKmeyerM.htm


Peace,
K

11:56 PM  
Anonymous Richard said...

To slomo,

I don't disagree with you, but doesn't that make you want to ask exactly who is the primitive here?

Are we caught in some huge de-evolutionary spiral?

After all, which system is sustainable, & which system is destined to swallow itself like a snake eating its own tail?

I used to work on a production line in a chem plant. I worked right next to this older black fella who used to take great pleasure in trying to bait me into punching him in the face.
I was young so he almost succeeded a few times, but one of his more piss poor efforts had him saying, "Well white boy, how does it feel to have the blood of the conqueror in you?"

I got a good laugh out of that one since my "conqueror blood" must have been a bit anemic to be working the same shit job as one of the "conquered."

I assume he thought my laughter was more along the lines of "damn straight, black boy."

He obviously meant that as an insult but from another perspective it could be viewed as a compliment.

The slave mentality is encoded in our language.
Words like elite & powerful & leader suggest submission even if used in the context of criticism.

Maybe we, as a species, aren't far enough away from the "Sun-King" era to be completely up & off our knees.

Maybe, since "God's away on business" most of the time & the majority of us don't really have a clue, we help ourselves sleep at night by nurturing the obvious delusion that someone somewhere really does know what the fuck is going on.

Or maybe it's like Charles Bukowski said, "Humanity? We never had it from the beginning."

12:21 AM  
Anonymous Dr. Theopolis said...

'When this kind of fire starts. it is very
hard to put out.

The tender bows of innocence burn first
and the wind rises - then all goodness
is in jeopardy.'
from 'Fire walk with me'

5:51 AM  
Anonymous slomo said...

Richard,

We are indeed in a devolutionary spiral, according to the author of the book I mentioned. Collectively, our only hope of salvation is total collapse.

Fortunately -- proving that there are indeed forces of good prevailing in the world -- total collapse is inevitable, one way or another.

[Before you attack me as some terrible demon: I'm not diminishing the utter horrible human suffering that is likely to follow in the wake of collapse... the only thing worse would be the eternal hell of the increasingly authoritarian and totalitarian state, with its consequent elimination of all freedom and certain misery and death for all who are not at the center of its locus of power.]

5:56 AM  
Anonymous jules said...

Years ago I read Alesteir Crowley's commentry on his tarot deck.

One of the few things I remember from that book was a comment that the suit Swords is the one closest to the Western Scientific worldview.

Supposedly: A sword is the most appropriate metaphor for the process of science because of its reductionist worldview, because it involved the seperation of things into discrete events seperate from the universe. Then the measurement of them against each other.

It was a point of duality that seperated the universe into subjective and objective events yadda yadda yadda

Western science is not wholostic, and it refuses to recognise what it cannot measure. This is great as a method for making some deductions about reality, and is useful in that it has enabled this internet thingee we are using right now. But to say that it explains everything is wrong, it only explains what it measure, with reference to the process of measurement, and very little else about what is measured.

It is the way science dices reality into seperate parts to understand the world that IMO underpins its mephistopalian nature. It claims that that is all that is relevant in nature, what it beyond it limits is either non existant of not worthy of consideration. Instead of beyond its ability to currently comprehend.

In that view it could be viewed as an anti christ. It(Science as an institution not a process,) acts like its the one true religion. The holder of all knowledge and the only true path to heaven.

More religious crap.

I guess the sword metaphor Crowley used also appealed to me cos I dropped out of third year science degree because I got sick of the killing. We slaughtered so many little critters, got them shit faced on drugs then did horrible things to them. Then killed them afterwards regardless of whether they were used or not.

Ultimate snuff porn. Killing a rat and looking at its reproductive organs under a microscope.

I always felt that the treatment of animals in labs was a continuation of the holocaust, and part of a desensitisation process, tho whether a deliberate ploy by the ruling elite or an unavoidable side effect of a culture possessed? Probably the latter.

People talk about shamanism and indigenous cultures all the time, but they forget that in indigenous cultures the world is part of our family, and that often authority resides in the external powers of creation, although they empower society to act in certain ways...

Also everyone in the society has a role and a relationship with creator gods. or whatever.

Shamans might know more about dealing with the world and stuff, but everyone has access and the shamans do not always monopolise acess to the sacred. It is everywhere and cannot be monopolised.

Crowley also referred to knowledge as daarth, or illusion...

not that Crowley is that worthy of anything in particular, certainly a good role model as far as what not to do...

6:55 AM  
Blogger Sounder said...

Richard said;

"The slave mentality is encoded in our language.
Words like elite & powerful & leader suggest submission even if used in the context of criticism."

Excellent comment, I like how it ties into,

"In fact, it appears the rich & well-heeled aren't the only ones who whole-heartedly embrace the "perversion of man's perception of the outer world."

I am swimming in intimations of the ineffable while I ponder the various expressions of this little club.

Anon 10:11 Thank-you for being here. You may come to see that while many here are driven by so called 'Gnostic' impulses, we, just like you, seek connection to the divine.

When you say, "Man left to his own devices,” Is a corrupted priest class the proper device for controlling the masses? Perhaps, if the people cannot think for themselves.

Even so, does not the paternal figure carry the responsibility to ameliorate the ignorant condition of ones charges?

Given the social nature of our relations, no one is left to their own devices. Yet the question remains, what devices will serve to better harmonize our expressions to the will of G-d?

7:53 AM  
Anonymous Shrubageddon said...

I used to be quite the rebel in my youth.....hell, I'm still quite the rebel, I've just found highly effective camaflouge. I smoked weed, in high school, on the weekends with several high school buddies. We'd hang out at the park with Edgar often times. Edgar was a Pre-med drop-out from a prestigious university. He had a nervous break-down and apparently never recovered. We found him fascinating, and would pick his brain whilst riding the glorious wave of our high. Edgar would take a toke here and there, but he preferred his paint thinner.....and who could blame him.

Anyhow, recently my mother revealed a disturbing bit of inforamtion to me about those days gone by, and those days gone by have been quite some time now. She indicated that during that time, she received a package in the mail at her place of employ from an anonymous source that contained a cassette tape. The package also contained a note that said "this is your son. You should be concerned." She played the tape and said it was so awful it makes her cringe when she thinks about it. She said it was a tape of me. It was distinctly my voice, but other than that, she didn't recognize the character. She said I sounded positively evil......that I sounded possessed and said some of the most awful things she had ever heard. I was skeptical, naturally, but she swore up and down it was true. She said she would never make up a thing like that. I asked her if she had a copy of the tape, and she said she didn't. She discarded it, because she didn't want to believe it was me. Since she wouldn't give me details abou what I allegedly said on the tape, it was hard for me to defend myself against the perception she had.

Ever since my mother has mentioned this, it has freaked me out. Was it me on that tape? Who sent the tape? If it wasn't me, who was it, and why would someone send my mother something like that? If it was me, I want to hear the tape, but I will never have the chance. Did one of my buddies do it? One of the guys was somewhat untrustworthy, so perhaps it was him, but why? Also, what did I say or do on the tape that disturbed my mother so much?

My mother indicated that she was afraid to confront me about it then, and she's been afraid for me ever since.

Of course, my mind races to fill the knowledge gap. My imagination kicks into gear. Perhaps I was abducted and induced to say evil things on a tape and then my memory of it is erased. Maybe I'm an MK Ultra candidate, much like a Manchurian Candidate, kind of like an unwitting sleeper cell laying dormant until the trigger mechanism is activated.

Who knows.

The point is, I have information, but it is fragmented and incomplete. I would like for the information to become knowledge, but I can't. Anything I postulate is pure conjecture. The sad thing is, my mother has accepted that information as knowledge. She has fomented the opinion that her son is a psychotic with a dual personality who can shap at any moment.

Knowledge and Information. It's a dangerous dance with significant implications.

9:48 AM  
Anonymous Nate said...

Re Crowley: I glanced briefly at a new biography of him in a bookstore this week, and was startled to see that he grew up in, of all things, the Plymouth Brethren! Exclusives, too, IIRC.

Yes, Charles Darby's outfit - originators of the Rapture mythos, deeply hung up on the End Times and Antichrist, convinced that the rest of the world was already damned and that the Spirit had departed, hunkered down to wait for the end.

I grew up in a Brethren-derived church. Suddenly I felt deeply sympathetic for Crowley. Mad nasty old bugger I'm sure he was, but... see, now I understand his Antichrist fixation, and, well. It just felt sad, really.

If he thought the Christian God was the God of the Exclusive Brethren, and decided to dedicate his life to fighting against that... I'm not sure God would hold that against him, exactly. Right sort of idea, not exactly the smartest way of going about it.

(I don't really know what kind of morality I buy into. I do believe in karma and stuff and that every evil act has consequences. I just get this impression of a sad, lonely kid at high school figuring 'I gotta choose Evil to get away from this crap' and getting to Heaven and God going 'Sorry... I know you thought you were selling your soul to evil, and yes you did a lot of really bad and stupid things and all but I can't accept it as Unforgiveable Blasphemy, because you didn't actually start out with the right idea of Me in the first place. You're not actually the Antichrist after all. You gave a damn, for one thing.')

It made a lot of sense, though, to me, as I'd always suspected there was a lot of darkness in the Brethren, and there was a deep link in kind between Satanism (from what I've read of ritual abuse cults) and the grimmest, most self-righteous 'Christian' cults. I didn't realise it was so blatantly obvious though.

10:01 AM  
Blogger 23skidoo said...

Funny to see this after my recent revisitation of Grant Morrison's Invisibles comic series. Now that I have a little time on my hands, I will be reading more about occult, magick systems, and philosophy. I am suspicious of assertions that cannot be verified or are not true a priori, with no explanation of their origin, or without credible reference. Probably a result of too much education.

Of course, a person cannot reject everything out of hand just because those elements are lacking: It's true, faith and induction play a role in day-to-day operations. Perhaps a sort of "contingent acceptance" is appropriate, when a person has criteria for accepting a superior idea or belief, ie one that is better reasoned, has more contextual support, has more inherent logic, and fits better with her overall worldview.

One puzzle in my undergrad studies was whether tautologies should be discarded as poor logical arguments. I suspect now that the solution may be that knowledge is by its nature something that exists in relationships between or among things, just as the first poster (shrubageddon) in this comment section suggested. Knowledge is maybe not relative so much as the way relations between things are described. Faith may be allowing a tautology, circular argument, or unilateral assertion of fact to be at the foundation of any logical argument, or any belief system.

I hope to pursue an advanced degree relating to these ideas. By God, Richard's comments are disturbing, and somehow ring true to me.

12:40 PM  
Anonymous jules said...

"If he thought the Christian God was the God of the Exclusive Brethren, and decided to dedicate his life to fighting against that... I'm not sure God would hold that against him, exactly. Right sort of idea, not exactly the smartest way of going about it."

Yeah crowley was either a joke or incredibly smart, because there is no way you can take him seriously, he called his life story a fucking autohaigiography... ie a saint recognising he's a saint and telling his life story in that context. Yet there are some gems in his stuff.

A few people consider he was possessed by and obsessed with chronozon, a term for the demon that exists in the creations of our own ego. That makes alot of sense. At the same time he had some genuine insight and probably contributed to the (temporary)overthrow of power structures that caused him so much pain as a child.

I think one of the reasons he carried so much of a reputation as a successful magician was that the abilities required were so atrophied and untrained in his culture at the time. A smattering of hard work and a shitload of media savvy was all he needed to create such a reputation. Well thats my opinion. If you want to see magic on a daily basis at the moment, watch the world cup.

Shrub, I think the difference between knowledge and information is the conclusions that are drawn and the value they are given.

Certainty and knowledge seem to be inseperabwhen viewed this way. certainty can actually be accurate. We can be certain some thing will occur or did occur, and we may be correct, but the relationship between our certainty or knowledge, and its success in describing events can be extremely tenuous.

What is knowledge?

What is knowing?

What is gnosis?

To me these things are differentiated by their use of symbol systems.

Gnosis is an overwhelming exposure to raw reality, unfiltered by the constructs we have created previously in our lives.

Knowing is similar, a recofnition of some underlying pattern, but without the overwhelming power. It creates an awareness of the processes without being fully overwhelmed by that awareness.

To me this seems to be most appropriate in physical or flight or fight situations. Real woprld interactions with ones whole body and mind.

Knowledge is the manipulation of the symbols that we have used to represent the experience we have known. It is an abstract process, often taking place away from the point of action, and involves the manipulation of symbols in an isolated enviroment, and rarely integrates new, raw sensory data, or operates in a situation where it is necessary.

9:51 PM  
Blogger Sounder said...

I laugh at orthodoxy and the hold it has on the common imagination. Any system for understanding creates correspondences between categories. We see people use ridiculous systems both in the past and still now. The results speak for themselves. Still, a purpose is served and as the limits of our relative truths become more apparent, we can better transition if we work on shaping the elements that may form our next level of understanding.

Our current fragmented system of understanding provides connections between categories of a similar kind, but very little connection between categories of divergent ‘kinds’. The resulting specialization provides an insulative space from which conformity can be assured. A system that exhibits correspondences between wider sets of categories will still be relative truth, yet it will certainly have a more dynamic relationship to reality.

And the Word was made flesh.

23skidoo;

Perhaps I am more skeptical than you, I prefer ‘possibility factor’ to ‘conditional acceptance’.

7:41 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Richard asked:

"When you say, "Man left to his own devices,” Is a corrupted priest class the proper device for controlling the masses? Perhaps, if the people cannot think for themselves."

I don't think of it in those terms. I certainly agree (with who--Yeats?) that "corruption of the best is the worst," but corruption is corruption. I would assume everyone on this board agrees that child molestation is about as corrupt as you can get.

I don't think of Catholicism as being about "controlling the masses," not anymore, if it ever was. Perhaps I've been too much influenced by Thomas Merton and Tomas a Kempis, but I see it as being counter-cultural, and, beyond that, as deeply radical. The premise (articulated so well in Kempis' "Imitation of Christ") that wealth is filth hardly dovetails with Madison Avenue. Having once contemplated the meaning of abnegation, it is difficult to ever view capitalist marketing techniques as anything but deception. The commercial with the aliens fishing for beer drinkers: such an apt metaphor, yet how many in the audience see it that way? Call me nutty, but long ago I started applying this simple test to virtually everything uttered on network news: it is the exact opposite of the truth. In most cases, particulary political news, the test proves right.

I look askance at political alliances of so-called "evangelical" Christians and the war pigs (and yes, I'm using Black Sabbath's nomenclature, because of its power). It is a falsification, a transmogrification of anything true about the teachings of Christ. I would argue that it is, quite literally, a diabolical inversion of Christ's truth. The war pigs bring not light, but darkness. Theirs is the unholy false light of nuclear blasts, of incendiaries that shred the flesh of children. Is that not child molestation, too? Who with eyes to see does not recognize that?

If Blogger is working today, I'll try to post a little piece about Gnosticism which I found interesting.

Blessed be the Homers.

4:02 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hi, Blogger is working, and I'm back (in black).

Here's a conventional definition of Gnosticism:

Whereas Judaism and Christianity, and almost all pagan systems, hold that the soul attains its proper end by obedience of mind and will to the Supreme Power, i.e. by faith and works, it is markedly peculiar to Gnosticism that it places the salvation of the soul merely in the possession of a quasi-intuitive knowledge of the mysteries of the universe and of magic formulae indicative of that knowledge. Gnostics were "people who knew", and their knowledge at once constituted them a superior class of beings, whose present and future status was essentially different from that of those who, for whatever reason, did not know

This is the part I found interesting, the part about pessimism. Change the channel if you don't like this programme, but I'd be interested in RIers thoughts about this:

Although the origins of Gnosticism are still largely enveloped in obscurity, so much light has been shed on the problem by the combined labours of many scholars that it is possible to give the following tentative solution: Although Gnosticism may at first sight appear a mere thoughtless syncretism of well nigh all religious systems in antiquity, it has in reality one deep root-principle, which assimilated in every soil what is needed for its life and growth; this principle is philosophical and religious pessimism. The Gnostics, it is true, borrowed their terminology almost entirely from existing religions, but they only used it to illustrate their great idea of the essential evil of this present existence and the duty to escape it by the help of magic spells and a superhuman Saviour. Whatever they borrowed, this pessimism they did not borrow -- not from Greek thought, which was a joyous acknowledgment of and homage to the beautiful and noble in this world, with a studied disregard of the element of sorrow; not from Egyptian thought, which did not allow its elaborate speculations on retribution and judgment in the netherworld to cast a gloom on this present existence, but considered the universe created or evolved under the presiding wisdom of Thoth; not from Iranian thought, which held to the absolute supremacy of Ahura Mazda and only allowed Ahriman a subordinate share in the creation, or rather counter-creation, of the world; not from Indian Brahminic thought, which was Pantheism pure and simple, or God dwelling in, nay identified with, the universe, rather than the Universe existing as the contradictory of God; not, lastly, from Semitic thought, for Semitic religions were strangely reticent as to the fate of the soul after death, and saw all practical wisdom in the worship of Baal, or Marduk, or Assur, or Hadad, that they might live long on this earth. This utter pessimism, bemoaning the existence of the whole universe as a corruption and a calamity, with a feverish craving to be freed from the body of this death and a mad hope that, if we only knew, we could by some mystic words undo the cursed spell of this existence -- this is the foundation of all Gnostic thought. It has the same parent-soil as Buddhism; but Buddhism is ethical, it endeavours to obtain its end by the extinction of all desire; Gnosticism is pseudo-intellectual, and trusts exclusively to magical knowledge.

Now, take me out to the Baal park.

4:08 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Jeff, quoting Pinchbeck:

"Our age of materialism represents the temporary ascendance of Ahriman, who strives to make the world into a machine."

I have been quipping for years that working with computers forces you to become a computer. The mindless, unforgiving nature of the darned things...no mistakes allowed. It does seem...unhuman...antihuman, if being human means laughing and playing and goofing around. Computers don't laugh.

In our economy, we also see the imperative of the machine at work: "efficiency" is the highest good, the thing the corporate automaton must strive for. And what is most efficient of all? The machine! How long, dear readers, before the last refuge of the American economy, the fabled "service sector," is replaced by robots? Ten years? Twenty? Robots will be ever cheerful, never surly, never hung-over. Robots won't make errors. Those countries currently winning out in the manufacturing job loss wars will also find robots replacing their human workers. In fact, almost every case of regular labor will be replaced, as soon as feasible, by robots. Why?

Because it's more efficient. And our beloved immortal corporations demand efficiency.

Blessed are the efficient. For their profits shall increase.

Perhaps President Schwarzenegger will save us. Oh, wait, bad idea...

4:26 PM  
Anonymous jules said...

>>The Gnostics, it is true, borrowed their terminology almost entirely from existing religions, but they only used it to illustrate their great idea of the essential evil of this present existence and the duty to escape it by the help of magic spells and a superhuman Saviour.<<

This is the fundamental flaw of Gnosticism, if you ask me.

Speaking from my own experience, this world is a fundamentally good.

Maybe if I was raped when young, lost my home to bombs and my family to premature death, then I would agree. But I didn't suffer through all that.

I have not had an easy life, but after experiencing what I would consider Gnosois, or what some people refer to as Samahadi. The world is a place that is either funbdamentally good or neutral.

"and the duty to escape it by the help of magic spells and a superhuman Saviour"

This duty to escape existance is rubbish. It disempowers people and makes them irresponsible.

Indigenous communities that I am aware of and have interacted with, and kind of been part of as far as someone from a different cukture can, reject this concept as childish. They understand the energis that drive creation are powerful and dangerous. But thoae energies are more like a highway with semi trailers and road trains.

And we are more like kangaroos, or rabbits or whatever ends up roadkill in your part of the world.

They are not deliberately malevolent, but if you are in the way they will not stop or change course.

Indigenous communities have this idea that when practising traditional ceremmonies, humans offer their bodies and awareness to personifications of these creation forces. The purpose being to further the chances of life.

These forces are allowed "possession", but in these rituals, the possession is in a context of controlling sacred energy and balancing it, specifically to maintain life.

>>Here's a more concrete way to distinguish between types of war: if you are going to war with your neighboring tribe to settle a dispute over hunting territory (either because you believe your tribe deserves more or theirs deserves less), then you'll probably fight and kill only as much as you need to establish your position. This is a "war" that is consistent with life, and is happening at all levels from the subatomic to the human to the galactic. <<

This is the process that seemed to be at play for indigenous peoples.

In (Indigenous)Australia there are very specific prescriptions on casual murder (of people or animals). Or there were, when the culture was strong. But there were occasions when surrounding tribes would be allowed to murder an entire mob in cold blood. This was when that group had so obviously rejected the rules of life, that their continued existance was an offence to the land.

I don't know of any occasions of this happening, but I have heard it referred to as a last resort.

Individuals who murder animals suffer the same fate, but killing for food, medicine or other resources is allowed.

So war would be more often around the abuse of esources, not control of them, and really in indigenous Australian culture the main reason for wars was fighting over women.

However here is a wild story.

For those that have heard of Australian Rules Football, here's an insight into its origin:

In Melbourne the Yarra river runs through the city, and defines it in some ways, those South of the river are well to do, well it used to be that way.

Now two suburbs on the North side of the Yarra - Richmond and Collingwood, apparantly corresponded to two tribes territory. Ever year in September (The traditional end of the modern footy season) they would apparantly play a game of something very similar to Aussie Rules. From sunup to sundown they would play this game, and the winning side won control of the hunting and fishing along the river.

Both groups used the resources but the winners had priority and could make rules that controlled the other groups hunting and fishing. then the white settlers wanted the land so they massacred both tribes.

This is a dirty secret in the Australian AFL establishmant, and is never mentioned pubically, its only through families that were there at the start, that story is remembered, its part of the Whitefellas oral tradition.

Anyway in some form of penance and tribute the game was copied and merged with Gaelic football to form the best, and most spectacular cose of football in existance ;)

Everyone says sport is sublimated war, but I think it is a religious thing. Wars for resources are as rare as hens teeth in Australian aboriginal history, but wars for dunb human reasons are well recognised. Sport was practised throughout the continent and often in a context similar to taday (without the cash or satellite coverage).

The religious aspect of this is a celebration of what humans are capable of, a celebration of the transcendance of what we percieve as the limits of what we can do. Sport enabled us to show off in a religious context. (I suppose it still does, after all sport is professional and Mammon is God.) An aspect of existance that the Gnostics seem to have missed.

8:10 PM  
Blogger Syn Diesel said...

Anonymous' view of Gnosis is bunk. Gnosis is True Knowledge, Wisdom, something which can not be learned or taught, only remembered and experienced. It has diddly squat to do with homo sapien's trend to hubris and playing with fire. Tell me I don't know what I know and I'll put you on my list of personalities to keep a close eye on.

Maybe a God which should be invoked in this discussion is Prometheus? Fire can destroy but it can also create. Both ends involve moral and ethical measures. I am just as wary of people telling me not to work with fire as I am of those that play with it with abandon.

3:42 AM  
Blogger Syn Diesel said...

Luposapien said...

"The ends don't justify the means. So far as I can tell, at least a few questionalbe assumptions go into this. One, that we can accurately predict all of the results of our actions. But, more importantly, that there is such a thing as an 'End' in the first place. Beyond that, even if we decided to take some arbitrary point in space/time as our chosen 'end', what is it if not the expression of the combined influences of the means which led up to it. It seems more accurate to say 'The end is determined by the means.'"

The means are the ends. We don't get to the end until the means are right.

7:02 AM  
Blogger Syn Diesel said...

http://deoxy.org/plurifrm.htm

Nobody read this yet?


The belief that we are pluriforms of God voluntarily descended to this prison world, voluntarily losing our memory, identity and supernatural powers (faculties), all of which can be regained through anamnesis (or, sometimes, the mystical conjunction), is one of the most radical religious views known in the West. But it is known. It is regarded as the Great Blasphemy: replication of the original sin mentioned in the First Book of Adam and Eve and in Genesis. For this pride and aspiration (we are told by orthodoxy) our original fall and exile and punishment, our being taken from our home the gardenland and put into the prison, was inflicted on us. "They wish to be equal to - like - us," the Elohim say, and toss us down. Yet I have reason to believe that this, "the Great Satanic Blasphemy," is true."

8:12 AM  
Blogger Syn Diesel said...

Existence exists. I exist, therefore I am existence. Welcome to the world.

8:28 AM  
Blogger Syn Diesel said...

slomo said:

[Before you attack me as some terrible demon: I'm not diminishing the utter horrible human suffering that is likely to follow in the wake of collapse... the only thing worse would be the eternal hell of the increasingly authoritarian and totalitarian state, with its consequent elimination of all freedom and certain misery and death for all who are not at the center of its locus of power.]



What the mutherfuck is the difference? You idiots need to stop acting like you've seen the mountaintop.

9:59 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

You idiots need to stop acting like you've seen the mountaintop.

...or at least post some facts or something besides yet more whacked rambling whinings peppered with "I think"s.

I certainly don't do that.

;-)

ps:
R.A. Wilson used to go off on "experts" and what little it takes to label yourself as one.
"Words like elite & powerful & leader suggest submission..."
A judge or a cop or a priest look plain ordinary without the garb.


"What you believe imprisons you"

9:07 PM  
Blogger Syn Diesel said...

I was just trying some aversion-therapy posting style. It helps break up the random flow type posting.

;=)

8:14 AM  
Blogger Syn Diesel said...

nobody gets it?

11:05 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Wish you a happy and prosperous new year.
Soleilmavis
http://soleilmavis.blogspot.com

12:40 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hi,
I just fought some enemy nutcases myself.
They all hate Satan and believe lies about him, so they are all fair
game. They have now shut down the blog to anonymous comments.
They now have a contolled forum, and are looking for new software to
lock out ip's.

That is no problem as I can us multiple ip addresses, but they can
only close down it down now to stop me.

The jews there really went berserk with any mention of them being the
root of the problem.

That really blew their minds.

Satan being real is also taboo, as they cursed him and denigrated him.

Here is a sample of the bullshit from enemy I was getting daily,
defending and explaining Satanism to the few who really wanted to learn.
The rest wanted war and got it right back in their faces.

I was getting to them and they were unable to stop it for over a
month. I began to think Jeff was himself might be a Satanist, for he
never stopped it for over a month,letting go on and on.

As of now I am not sure now, they know he needs money and support to
get published, he has two books, likes to qoute RAW and it is strange
as to why now he censored me, citing mefor inciting hate.

But their stopping at nothimg for the truth about them getting out is
what gets them really upset.

SATAN and his so called minions are no problem till write that he is a
ancient god, not an archtypes but a real being.
I told Jeff that I thought the real reason was that the disrespectful
jew boy brat, he flatly denies this to me though and now the blog is
dead in the water, so he loses.

Even though it happened DIRECTLY WITHIN MINUTES right after he wrote
in to Jeff to stop it.
He began pulling all my posts with no warning or explanation till what
he said after the fact, which I told him eas a lie.

It is not him or even me, but his ignorant readers who are the problem
they want war and start wars,allowing no free thought.

As I had made already my point and was winding up the operation
anyway, then this happened.
Then others were now beginning to attack me in intensity and with long
blank posts, ect.
So I slapped them back hard.

Perhaps he is just giving in to the whining jew boy who probally
already wrote to the adl and all the other front organizations for the
zionists. They no doubt threatened him in writing telling him how they
will only support him if he endorses their views ONLY and shitcans all
others against what their agenda is.

So I think yhet threatened to destroy him, so much for standing up for
freedom of expression.

My blog alias I used was mostly Sabina,
Oh, they just loved me there, but really I had a few fans who
supported me and learned too.

read on.......... ....

************ ********* ********* ********* ********* *

the Lying Fool Sabina said... "Christian/s" is their code word for
Gentile/s in the protocols and in the talmud. The TALMUD was written
500+ years before the advent of Christianity, O forked-tongue devil.
Get thee behind me, and run the other way. I would say you are a liar
to the bone, but you are spineless.
6:31 AM
************ ********* ********* ********* ********* ****
musilman said... la ilaha illa llaharab ( islamic robotic nonsense)
6:33 AM

************ ********* ********* ********* *
D'oh said...Anonymous said...
Sabrina and company!!!!! !!!!!!!!! Please, what is the point??? What is
it that you all want from this virual spewing of hate and Why are you
being so so disrespectful to Jeff???? You all must be in a lot pain
and are not dealing very well with the HUMAN DILEMMA we are all
participating in. Evolution is upon us whether you like ot not. Go
play somewhere else. We WILL ignore you.

What SWEETHEARTS you are!!! HAPPY VALETINE'S DAY!!!!!

LOVE and KISSES

REDRUM!REDRUM! REDRUM!RED. . Ahhh.... Fuck it. My arthritis is acting
up.. 10:34 PM

************ ********* ********* ********* *******

First jewboy the disrespectful brat, posted this to let us know:

http://rigorousintu ition.blogspot. com/2005/ 08/nine-angles- of-separation. html
Rigorous Intuition: Nine Angles of Separation

Jeff Wells is coming across like any other website operator who
ignores the constructive criticism of the sincere while allowing the
trolls and disinfo agents to get away with whatever crap they want to
post.

How is anyone supposed to post a meaningful comment when this is
taking place?

How long is one supposed to ignore the warning signs that the forum
operator might be a paid actor?

Whoever these people are, it is true that they steal others' writings.
Where are the links?

More important, why does Jeff Wells allow this to continue?

Why should I think you are for real Jeff Wells?

Why do you ignore the few left who actually do their own writing and
none of it is some type of cryptic mind game?

The thing about the Wizard of Oz was that when the curtain was finally
pulled back on the evil operator, there was actually nothing to be
afraid about.

It was all a scam. So Jeff Wells thinks it's wrong to think that
anybody posting might be a disinformation agent. Fine. Yet, your
inability or refusal to clean things up makes one wonder about what
you (they?) are really trying to accomplish with your blog and forum.

Would it be that difficult to have someone moderate this blog comment
section and start deleting and banning this crap?

You commented that you couldn't even get to the last 100 comments on
the previous thread.

It's because the spammer/disinfo jammed the pages, and here they seem
to be at it again. When are you going to address this? Are you? If you
are legit, then this must be what is bugging you. Maybe you figure if
you ban the trolls/disinfo spam, they will just come back through
proxies. But you simply ignore it and let it fester.

One might think that this place is all about making people feel that
nothing can ever be figured out, that we all need to be prepared for
waking up screaming more often.

I think people like myself are more likely to be banned than the
disinfo/spammer trolls.

All indications are that you are just another wizard of oz, with one
image on the surface with the reality being something quite different.

What did you write a few blogposts back, that your mother once saw
some half creature/half human form outside the window?

Wasn't it presented as if it really happened, and that it was
unexplainable?

The more you let this section and your forum deteriorate, things like
what you say your mother witnesses and other things make one wonder
who the frick you really are, of what you really are tring to accomplish.

I'm starting to think Fintan Dunne was correct about internet fakes.
Unfortunately, he also appears to be a strawman for such a profound
and disturbing realisation, that the internet is overrun by disinfo
and mass psychological operations.

Maybe the thread running through all this misdirection and
conditioning is all about the more you know, the more danger you are
in, so just move along, nothing to see here, or if need be, go check
out Rense or any of the other "truth" websites for entertainment
purposes only.

You there Jeff Wells?

Are you going to at least tell these "satanists" and any other
spammers that this is not proper posting, and that if they want to
stay here, that this has to stop?

How long are people supposed to wait until like some above decide that
there really isn't much of value to be attained by visiting your
websites? Or is that the plan?

Are real people with real questions and comments the ones who are not
wanted on the internets? You are the decider, this is on you.

MORE of the disrespectful jewboy who now writes,

Sabina, your whole "enki as satan" thing had been tickling my memory
for a while now, as well as some of the loooong and uncalled for
cut'n'pastes. ..just something in my past that I could not put my
finger on... it finally hit me... you guys are cribbing from the Joy
of Satan ministries (yeah, i mentioned that before, but didn't realize
what i had stumbled across).

About 7-8 years ago when i was actively researching the occult I got
into satanism, from lavey to theistic, and came across a bunch of
xeroxes from the Joy of Satan.

They were everything I have been describing in my comments, basically
an idiotic mishmash of new-age bs.

I just ignored 'em outright as there were other, philosophically
sound, branches of satanism (no, really).

Then the news reports slowly trickled in over a the years. Ya see, the
other satanists where getting annoyed that this Joy of Satan bs were
tying themselves to a bunch of neo-nazi groups.

It came out that the founder of Joy of Satan, Maxine Dietrich (real
name: Andrea Herrington), is married to Cliff Herrington, founder of
the National Socialist Movement.

It was (or is) dogma of JoS that the jews are of a separate reptialian
race that are traitors to humanity and...well, a buch of other
anti-semetic shit I can't really remember off the top of my head.

Something about when satan returns the first thing he will do is wipe
out the jews...slimy shit.

Maxine would also routinely accuse people inside and outside of the
joy of Satan of being "dirty jews", etc.

Here's an anti-hate site discussing the National Socialist stuff
(scroll down to the very bottom to see the NSM ties to Joy of Satan):


http://www.johnnyle eclary.com/ nsm.htm

It turned out that Joy of Satan wasn't even welcome in the Neo-nazi
movement, once the association between JoS and NSM came out, both
satanists and neo-nazi's started blacklisting the Herringtons' groups.

Thats pretty bad when both satanists and hate-groups dislike your
company... for everyone else's information, JoS is apparently a
cultish satanist (in addtion to the racist) group that is set up to
make maxine money in "donations."

Most of the members seem to be teenagers rebelling against mommy's
religion.

Here's a website set up by an ex-member who was a high-priest in the
organization:

http://www.satans- powers.tk/

Here are some quotes about the JoS from an satanic discussion forum:

Naruthias: I have one word: bullshit. Why are we even bothering to
give such an in-depth examination to this bunch of misguided jokers? I
put them in line with the Heaven's Gate cult or the followers of
Charlie Manson. Just wackos looking for a place to fit in.

PieMan: I used to be a member of this cult, I was stupid to say the
least. Once I found out this was a nazi cult I quit though. After that
I dropped satanism all together. Reciently though ive gotten back into
the LaVey stuff.

virginmarydildo (great fucking name): had thought that the Joy of
Satan was a joke. Something put out there by a christian trying to
discredit satanists.
Are there really people out there who believe it? That is more absurd
than the christian bible.

According to this High Priest Dann, he joined when he was 15, and
wasted 3 years of his life with the group... so he was 18 when he left.

How can a group ran by kids be taken seriously?

Yes, I know Maxine is an adult... and finally,

RaveCorell: At JoS one of the names they use for Satan is Enki...a
supposed ancient Sumarian god, who also just happens to be an
alien...but what really captured my attention was the familiar style
of the writing and the terminology in general.

I would be willing to bet that it was Maxine Dietrich herself. I have
read most , if not all of writings, more than once, and it just seemed
way too familiar.

In fact a lot of what was posted seemed like it was right off the
pages of her website.

In the group they close their posts a lot with

Hail Enki

www.the600club. com forum, topic titled Satanism, Aliens & the Joy of Satan

So sabrina, please tell me, do you believe all this bs about the
jews...are you a neo-nazi...cause i'm sure the intelligent folk here
would like to know whether you are a racist or not...

And if you were truly suckered and had no idea, please check out Diane
Vera, she actually makes sense and doesn't make up shit about other
religions and history...an intelligent Satanist, if you will:


http://www.angelfir e.com/ny5/ dvera/

And if you are a racist fuck then just leave, we don't want none....
Again, to everyone, I am sorry this is so long...

"your friendly neighborhood disinfo agent"

aka the disrespectful brat writes for Jeff to censor me again,

"I'm not attacking Jeff Wells if he cleans it up."

Some one else then supports me and responds to his crap.
Telling the BRAT,

Nonsense. You'd attack anyone without provocation as we already have
seen. "Clean it up"? Censor? We like it dirty and real here. Or
rather, it's not that we like it, we would like to see it gets cleaned
up. Sunshine is the best disinfectant. Go away paid censorship whore
or pimp, traitor to everything. Every topic you mentioned is as real
as it gets. Think for yourself and you'll be amazed how lovely it is.
************ ********* ********* ********* ****

Some crazy mullah,

Yeah, I think it's called "auto-eroticism. " ar Rashid ~ the Righteous
Teacher as Sabur ~ the Completely Patient One LA ILAHA ILLA LLAH 8:15 PM

************ ********* ********* ********* ********* ********* ********* ********* ********* ******

A servant of God said...

How to exorcise Sabrina and fight the New World Order with the same
fell swoop: W.C. Fields said, "Never give a sucker an even break" And
P.T. Barnum, the circus man, said, "No one has ever lost money
underestimating the intelligence of the American people." Whichever
one of these hucksters you may hew to, or not, it is clear that Bush,
Cheney, the Neocons, the CFR, FOX news, even a few people on this blog
like Sabrina, not to mention the ever elusive illuminati have taken
both their dicta well..., not to heart, but in hand, and to that cold
empty space from which their occult forebears must have ripped it out.
All disinformation must contain elements of truth in order to be
effective. Disinformation can be 85 or even 98 percent factual. It's
that last fifteen, or even two percent of lies cloaked in truth where
the fatal trap is set, where the dagger is poised to strike. If you
are going to be had, that is where it is gonna getcha. HOW to DISCERN
the disinformation and the bullshit from the truth: The relevant
question is CUI BONO? What is the disinfo suggesting that you do. And
if you were to do it,

WHO BENEFITS? Let's look at the current memes on Iran, which are the
same as Sabrina's exhortations to readers here to fight the NWO:

"Prepare yourself to fight."

Be afraid.
Get angry.
Arm yourselves.

Watch out for the December solstice in 2012.

ORDO AB CHAO

That's the motto of the Kabbalist masons. That, along with BARI QVIPPE
BOVI, the Talmudic doctrine inscribed in marble over the fireplace in
the inner sanctum of the Skull and Bones tomb on High Street in New
Haven, Connecticut. They seek to foment chaos to strengthen their
rule. And they see us, the Barbarians, the "others" who are not they,
the "useless feeders" as Kissinger put it, as Indeed Cattle. Goyim =
cattle. Straight out of both the Babylonian Talmud and the Egyptian
Talmud, the two canons of Jewish law. To cheat, deceive, and even kill
the goyim is not merely permitted, it is a Talmudic obligation. A
promise to commit such deeds in the coming year is incorporated into
the men's prayers of Yom Kippur, the most sacred day of the Jewish
religious calendar, lest there be nothing to report on the next Day of
Atonement. So, regardless of whom you see as the arch-controllers,
their goal is all the same – to create chaos: to make people terrified
and full of hatred, and to get the maiming and killing going, big time.

They see it as their most "sacred" duty.

And that is basically the message being spread by Sabrina, who is
merely another whisperer of wiswas, a self-professed minion of the
pathetic one,

Satan, whose only power derives from what a human being willingly
yields...

OTHERWISE, THE SHAYATIN ARE COMPLETELY POWERLESS.

************ ********* ********* ********* ********* ***

sounder the xian fools turn,
Sabbateanism represents the negative polarity of the luciferic
impulse. It wants to tear down. (See end of comment section; last
thread for more perspective. ) It's really in league with fascism
because as anyone knows, if society is falling down, drastic measures
may be called for to control the situation. So sad that these types of
people get to do our thinking for us. Here's an idea, how bout we
learn to think better, so that we do not cede the field to dipshits.
************ ********* ********* ********* ********* ********* ********* ********* ********* ********* ********

JBD said... You would think that an all-powerful deity could do a bit
better than allow itself to be represented by such a tiresome,
ineffectual, and annoying internet poster with dubious cognitive
abilities but I guess some deities go into battle with the army they
have, rather than the army they wish they had.... beggars having
little choice and all 12:53 PM
************ ********* ********* ********* ********* ***

Sounder said... Right on JBD Lucifer's minion; The desire for
destruction is the swan song for the passing of a poisoned
consciousness. May you rest in pieces. 1:14 PM
************ ********* ********* ********* ********* ********* ********* ********* ********* ******
Sounder said... Satanists seem as insecure about their beliefs as the
xians are. Birds of a feather is my guess. Silly beliefs, thinking
that is what makes them better than the rest of us, when really this
is the thing that allows parasitical elemental forces to suck their
vitality. 8:50 AM
************ ********* ********* ********* ********* ********* ********* *********
TooStoned said... I am not interested in your ILLusions. No obviously
not. But somehow you think we are interested in your illusions. If not
my intentions are far from ever having sex and meeting her in person
silly wabbit Funny, I didn't think I accuses you specifically of that.
Or are you saying you have syphyllis? Me think thou doth protest too
much. Guilty concience, perchance? We know Satan to be the True Father
and Creator God of humanity. Why would the "true god" use the name
created by false gods? Get ove the "need a daddy tri." It makes you
susceptible to suggestion. And like Terrance McKenna once said, "there
is no great trick to hearing voices, but there is to knowing what to
listen too" I'm serious about the counseling; or better yet (head
shrinkers are a problematic bunch) go get a good dose of ibogaine and
spend the next 36 hours delving into your subconcious, you've
obviously walled off a good portion of it along with your sense of
humor and a substatial portion of your reasoning facilities. I could
go on, but why? Its like shooting shitpiles with a shotgun. Fun, but
can get messy and loses its novelty rapidly. I issue mr. spiritual
satanist to send some whammy my way today. I offer my neck as the
scape goat. Prove your power and daddy Satan's. If I live I'll post
here about your power and Satan's Gospel. Or are all your mindgames
the fantasy I can tell they are? 11:38 PM
************ ********* ********* ********* ********* *******

Sabrina wrote,

You curse yourself. I have no time to waste on you. Your words have
power. Use them carefully.
************ ********* ********* ********* ********* ********* ********* ****
Anony,

I denounce you as a whisperer of wiswas, one of the shayatin. Whoever
this jokester is, merely another dickless wonder in the legion of
trolls and yammering ghosts on this site, well, I don't want to leave
spouting obscenities, but you can use your own foul imagination to
fill in the blank, while you Analyse this: Since God works in
mysterious ways I will take this FINAL opportunity to correct one
other error in my last post and adieu, which was to have misplaced a
paragraph within the section quoted from the poster Free.

Many apologies to you, Miss or Ma'am (or Sir), for that error.

It was Free, who called Jeff out on repeatedly using the psyops
techniques of pederast perps in conflating satanic ritual abuse with
ufos and aliens, and who wrote so eloquently and straightforwardly.
Here is what Free said: I am a regular reader here and greatly
appreciate your articles and presence on the web but as an RA/MC
survivor I resent that you often talk about the UFO's and Ritual Abuse
in the same breath.

It's not that I have a hard time believing that there are UFO's or
life beyond our planet.

I would think it absurd for there not to be, but why do you continue
to mix us up with them? There are many "conspiracy" writers who do
this and I'm sick and tired of it.

What is the agenda here?

Infotainment?

Discrediting survivors?

Programming or confusing the general public?

It really irks me because it is the same thing that the perps did to
us as part of their programming (theatrical and high tech torture).

To confuse us, discredit us in case we remembered and hide their true
identities - they are a league of psychopaths - they staged torture
scenarios where they appeared as or they told us that they were
reptillians or extra-terrestrials. Understanding what's really going
on is an important step to solving global problems and I feel that by
mixing these two topics you are muddying the waters and creating
confusion. Herewith following then is, for the very last time (third
time's the charm), my, the, final words from the poster who has been
BILL HICKS RESURRECTED, Ibn Sina / Avicenna, & Mojo Filter and his
acronyms, not some damned poseur who can go to hell, where he/she/it
came from, or back under its slimy rock.

It incorporates for accuracy the needed corrections of Free's writings.

Thanks for providing that opportunity to do this well-meaning person
justice, in spite of your provocations, whisperer ~ Iblis.

Your machinations are nothing but another way in which God may assist
us to do better, if we are blessed with the presence of mind and heart
to avail ourselves.

And one last parting goodbye to Iridescent
Cuts-like-a- dull-butterknife -fish, who even now doesn't display the
guts, no less the heart, to respond like an honest man to this one or
any of my posts ever, not one, when made under the original handle of
Mojo Filter ~ although you did converse for awhile with Mojo Workout.
You were the primary reason I used the extra handles. My mistake to
think you were actually capable of intellectual honesty. I thought
that maybe it would be possible to engage you without the Mojo
baggage, and on occasion it was, but only superficially, and only when
praising you and agreeing with you when you said something bordering
on the noble ~ which was/is all too rare.

Whatever your gig is, I.C., I wish God's grace in opening your eyes
and ears, because wittingly or not, you are often the biggest tool on
this site (and no, that's not a compliment), not to mention your being
an insufferable Jeffzebub sycophant.

Maybe that's why you respond so readily to flattery. So it goes. Peace
to you in either case, and may you someday, somehow, somewhere,
experience the simultaneous turning toward and turning away that is
the grace of tawba with respect to the Almighty. Peace to you on your
journey, you who fight against your own fitra like it was the enemy.
What follows is every bit as true now as it was yesterday.

I guess it's just my way of saying three times,

"Get thee behind me, Satan."

____________ ______

Funny how after three threads lasting a couple of weeks that covered
a wealth of stuff, much of which was spiritually and morally uplifting
and informative, we come to the new year and Jeffzebub offers what?
the Demon....... again.

No joke, when I saw the picture at the top of the post I thought it
must be "Mr. Wells" himself. How ironic it was when I read someone
refer to it as Charlie Manson.

Funny how Mr. Photoshopmeister Wells himself managed to make a serial
killer psychopath tool look nearly cheerful and almost handsome.

Some dark shit psyop that is, my friends. So then what? We have reams
and reams of fecal verbosity, coprologia from the re-appearing
Richard/Jon/ Shrub/Jules troll, the darkside's equivalent of sewer
sherbert to clear the pentacled palate for.....yet another anonymous
spouting Satanic dogma.
************ ********* ********* ********* ********* **** Anonymous said...
Hi Jeff, great post as usual , love to read you from the boreal forest
up north Québec... can you do something please about al this
"satanist" spam on your comments ? thx !
9:24 AM
************ ********* ********* ********* ********* **
End of the messages against Satanists.

Now do you see why i fought these assholes for a month?

I hate them and their lies.

I am not done yet either, and with help we can start taking down these
sites that hate us.

YOUR MIND IS YOUR PRIMARY WEAPON
and
ALL WARFARE IS SPIRTUAL AND OF THE MIND
HAIL SATAN,
Sabina

11:40 PM  
Blogger Sean said...

Isn't it appears more funny in a....ummmm.....darkly ironic way, that white folks come along like the proverbial bull in a china shop & completely fuck up the mojo? Not that I'm implying Native Americans weren't warlike, it's just that I don't recall any historical instances where they were conducting huge canoe raids on Europe. Couple of my friends at web design company have their ancestral roots there so I am quiet familiar with it. But white folks come along & mutate it into this testostorone fueled self-destructive cornholing of the common good.

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